robinn2 [he/him]

I agree, face the wall

They’re the type of socialism (social democracy) that I approve of.

Social democracy is not socialism, it is social-fascism, class collaboration leeching off the wealth of the global south like a settler vampire from the hill of the imperialism. Look at how social democratic settlers treat immigrants, or minorities/natives. You fundamentally do not understand what socialism is.

And no offense, but you have no fucking idea what the the PRC is doing. You know nothing about their government structure, how policy is carried out, or the way the system functions at all. I guarantee you could not name the tiers of government, or even three government officials without looking it up. Your ignorance is shown right away by the fact that you say “CCP” (Chinese Communist Party) when the correct acronym is “CPC” (Communist Party of China). This is such a simple mistake that proves you have not read any media outside of the west regarding China.

Ugh horrible argument. No, you have to contend with the source I provided, not skip it and provide a different source, especially when the prolewiki page is a challenge to the Wikipedia page, and so citing the latter is like citing a work against which a polemic is directed at the polemic as an “alternative.”

Apparently Wikipedia is “not biased”, they just forbid certain sources, include U.S. government aligned sources by and large (this article you’ve cited sources Radio Free Europe, a CIA propaganda outlet; the New York Times summaries of situations in countries the U.S. is opposed to (this is done 10x), despite the source being a rubber stamp for the U.S. government; a Washington Post opinion article which completely obfuscates the nature of the press as a tool of class rule), and so on. Sorry, Wikipedia is biased.

It is their fault. They lost an argument only to whine about me and others in another thread (after willfully ignoring my response to their points) and now they say they “don’t have a lot of time” (they had time to write 400 responses and link multiple resources they didn’t verify) when asked to read, that’s textbook bad faith cowardice. This person you’re responding to, JohnDclay, is the asshole lib from the 500 response thread.

I’m trying to talk in good faith, but I don’t have 10 hours to read about it. I’ve only researched about 1 or 2 hours. But I’m definitely not just taking your website at face value.

Right, so you didn’t read my carrd and then linked a different source instead (super good faith) that I completely refuted (apparently you felt no need to respond to my complete rebuttal]. So you didn’t read the comment or the response to your rebuttal, and yet you’re saying you’re acting in good faith because you don’t have a lot of time/haven’t done a lot of research? Whatever, then don’t act like you’re qualified to have an opinion.

But I’m definitely not just taking your website at face value.

What does this even mean? “Face value”? It’s a collection of sources. Seriously, if you don’t have the knowledge to even respond to my points, much less my complete refutation of your own points, don’t ghost respond to me acting like I’ve said something crazy to get support in another thread. It’s cowardly and pathetic.

I’m just so fed up with folks online regarding, what i would call state capitalist countries as genuine socialism,

Read up on your Trotsky fool

https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Authoritarianism

I will have you shot

Blocked 😩

Hey are you not responding to me because you know there’s no way to refute anything I said? I mean you cannot write a snarky rebuttal to my complete debunk of your nonsense. Go on tell me how they banned Winnie the Pooh and that Shanghai Disneyland website is fake, tell me how you can justify that awful Hong Kong point, go on.

China is pretty crazy and jails people for talking about Winnie the Pooh.

Complete BS. Here’s an exhibit on “The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh” in Shanghai Disneyland. It’s absurd that this is the only nonsense you can muster to justify China’s higher life expectancy (even given semi-colonial subjugation).

Cuba and Vietnam also have lower life expectancy than the US.

Cuba is a tiny country that has been massively sanctioned by the largest imperialist nation on earth (the US) for 60 years (after they defeated the U.S.-backed dictator Batista and stopped being a sugar colony of America). It seems that according to the World Bank (super unbiased lmao, and yes this is the same organization sourced in your Wiki article), Cuba’s life expectancy is ~73 while the U.S. is ~76. Personally, given the huge gap in development compared to the two countries, and that Cuba has not engaged in imperialism once whilst the U.S. is known for such things, this small difference is relatively impressive for Cuba and makes you look like a brainworm-infested child for implying a level playing field.

I didn’t think I’d have to explain Vietnam’s history of colonial subjugation by the French and imperialist plunder by the French, U.S., and U.K., of which millions of Vietnamese were killed through bombing/being burned alive. History does not matter of course, so let us analyze their life expectancy: ~74 years, whereas the U.S. life expectancy is ~76. With all this in mind, a two year gap somehow justifies the inherent “superiority” of the U.S. system!

Look at Hong Kong

I’ve looked, and @[email protected] already gave an excellent response to this (which of course you ignore in your reply). Don’t act snarky unless you’ve earned it, and you haven’t earned it.

“Socialism Always Fails”

I would love for a nonviolent approach to a different path. The PCI tried that in Indonesia and the US backed a massacre of over a million people and secretly bombed Indonesian territory under the pretext of popular discontent (see The Jakarta Method); Allende tried that in Chile, and the US backed a bloody coup, replacing him with the dictator Pinochet; this was tried in Afghanistan, in return for which the US backed terrorism with the express purpose of undermining reform, and with the result of worsening women’s and underprivileged rights and eventually returning to bomb the country and kill hundreds of thousands; Sankara was killed in. US-backed coup, so on and so forth, read Frantz Fanon “On Violence.” Instead of this critique being leveled at the US and their military apparatus, it is slyly redirected, and then the claim is put forward that the revolutionary only understands violence, can only operate through it. We see no peaceful road to liberating the third world from imperialism, not because this is what we wish but because any attempt is met with terror and bombs. I am not afraid to say that as a consolation the rabble will get on top by other means. Fuck America.

Death. To. America. Every one of your soldiers will be spit on and shot.

Bad

Edit: for all of the people praising “Taiwanese independence”, read this. Also, status quo is not “static” quo; we exist in the status quo where people are under the illusion of capitalism, of the propaganda of the capitalists and in this case of the US, which is continually provoking separatism, and which originally backed the KMT (for the continuation of semi-colonialism/feudalism) from which separatism stems (with the KMT performing numerous massacres against opposition); the visage of Chiang Kai-shek sits on physical Taiwan currency. Still, “臺灣民眾統獨立場趨勢分佈”, conducted by Taiwan’s National Chengchi University, an explicitly anti-CPC source, in 2022, showed the following results with regards to the perspective of Taiwanese citizens on independence and reunification: (Status Quo as Autonomous Part of China and Complete Unification Compiled [part of PRC] : 63.4%) (General Support for Independence Including Status Quo Moving Towards Independence [not part of PRC]: 30.3%) (Non-Response: 6.3%). Here we can see that in public opinion, remaining a part of the PRC has over double the support to becoming independent or pursuing independence at a later date, although support for total reunification is low, hence the policy of two systems being maintained to an even greater extent than with regards to Hong Kong, although accusations of military provocations by the mainland of China are alleged despite there being no examples of this.

The parties represent interests separate from and under the CPC, which is one of the largest political parties on earth and comprises of a tenth of the eligible population in China. The CPC is the party which represents the majority interests of the population, of which mas multiparty organization would merely atomize and undermine socialization.

Also stop saying ‘CCP’; you are illiterate lmao.

and yet almost all of the userbase is jingoistic westerners

deleted by creator

• Confidential cable from U.S. gov. embassy in Beijing showing US knew there was no firing in the square

• Hou Dejian, one of the leaders of the Tiananmen protests, saying he was in the square all night and saw no one killed

• Clearance of the Tiananmen Square on June 4, 1989

• CBS News correspondent: There Was No “Tiananmen Square Massacre”**

** “Constitutively and pathologically unable to simply own up to a past journalistic crime, the propaganda apparatus merely substitutes a new lie for the old one. The official death toll according to the Chinese government is, in fact, a matter of public record: Beijing Municipality has checked and double-checked all the figures from the Martial Law Command, the Public Security Ministry, the Chinese Red Cross, all institutions of higher education, and all major hospitals. These show that 241 people died. They included 23 officers and soldiers from the martial law troops and 218 civilians. The 23 military deaths included 10 from the PLA and 13 from the People’s Armed Police. The 218 civilians (Beijing residents, people from elsewhere, students, and rioters) included 36 students from Beijing universities and 15 people from outside Beijing.” [link]

This was not a “massacre” but a riot in which police and PLA soldiers were killed as well as civilians/rioters, as proven by the peaceful evacuation of the square and degeneration of the situation thereof.

Even the article you linked says china admits soldiers gunned down over 300 people.

This is a complete distortion (either lie or misunderstanding, I’ll assume the latter). It says that the government estimates 300 fatalities and that some victims were shot by soldiers. You are assuming that all of these deaths were from “300+ people being shot in the street”, but even in this article they mention that soldiers were beaten and burned alive (which factors into the total). This rough “300” figure was rectified a week later in a full report as ~200, with 36 of the casualties being college students.

We know nobody was killed in the square (see confidential cable from U.S. government embassy in Beijing), we know many soldiers were killed and beaten, that soldiers were also gunned down, and that most did not have weapons. So the square was evacuated peacefully (we have video of this) and then a riot broke out outside the square. Why would this be done if the government was intent on “gunning them down” anyways? Terrible comment, try better next time.

What the fuck do you even think my complaint is? it’s the rollback of covid precautions at a federal level, cutting the aid they were giving out, ending mask mandate. You shitheads acted like vaccines were a magic bullet because it was a convenient lie to tell everyone try to get ‘back to normal’. Instead you abdicate responsibility and act like it’s the most anyone could done.

Fye post, your harm reduction is a lie